Thanks Stu , that's appreciated

Like you I too find this behaviour appalling. In the main these are experienced sellers who know exactly what they are doing and why.
TO MAKE MORE MONEY!

Let's not mess with words here it is calculated, deceitful, bordering fraudulent and morally wrong.

Yes I accept 2 pictures taken in different light, different equipment and in different formats can look totally different but I too see lots of fellow sellers not describing things and on purpose not photographing certain 'negative' features. I have even seen my own sales re-advertised along these lines and have sent a nice email or two. The problem is greed takes over and lack of policing makes it seemingly worthwhile.

Regrettably for novice collectors this makes spending any amount of money a risky business as trust isn't there in fear of being scammed and then having a battle to get monies back.

This said on a positive note there are some good sellers out there and generally (I have found)the large auction market does refund your money if justified eventually.

I have always taken the stance: describe a book in basic English and list/photo all 'faults'. That way my conscious is clear, I have tried my best, the item isn't returned and more importantly a fellow Tolkien/Baynes collector spends their money well and enjoys the books as much as we do.

Finally I am off to Oxford today and really looking forward to it having ready all your reports. Never know may even buy a book or two with an intact spine

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The Hobbit - J.R.R Tolkien - Allen And Unwin

142887583953

Seller: united2013tom

(105)

Ended Jul 31, 2018

This item ended more than 90 days ago

1970s Hobbit with no title page or jacket for £3000, anyone?

For a 1970's Hobbit I'd value it at £0

That's what I told the seller

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J R R Tolkiens Fireplace Surround

153117749262

Seller: ronani52

(515)

Ended Aug 4, 2018

This item ended more than 90 days ago

Why have not given up with this junk, it is horrible and nobody wants it.

Trotter wrote:
For a 1970's Hobbit I'd value it at £0

As someone still trying to navigate their way across the apparent minefield of collecting Tolkien books, what gives this copy of The Hobbit away as being from the 1970s and not earlier as the seller claims? If people paid such prices for books like this, surely an unscrupulous seller could rip out the copyright page of the latest Hobbit facsimile and claim it was a "like new" copy of the 1937 original? I find it completely bewildering.

The illustrations in the book, are the main giveaway, as an example The Hill was the Frontispiece, up until I think the late 1960's. So this means it was on the left of the title page. If you look at the pictures, you can see The Hill is not the Frontispiece.

Additionally on the Spine, it states Allen & Unwin, not George Allen & Unwin.

Have a look at the Hobbit section on tolkienbooks.net, which goes into a lot more detail about these changes.

I think we would spot anyone who tried to pretend the facsimile is a true 1st/1st, the paper is completely different for a start.

George_V wrote:

Trotter wrote:
For a 1970's Hobbit I'd value it at £0

As someone still trying to navigate their way across the apparent minefield of collecting Tolkien books, what gives this copy of The Hobbit away as being from the 1970s and not earlier as the seller claims? If people paid such prices for books like this, surely an unscrupulous seller could rip out the copyright page of the latest Hobbit facsimile and claim it was a "like new" copy of the 1937 original? I find it completely bewildering.

Trotter pointed out some identifiers in his post above. The contents page is also a dead-giveaway. This was the message I had sent to the email seller when I first saw the auction:

"Hi, your book is a third edition. Anything from 1966 to 1975 (can't tell without the copyright page). However, the final entry on the contents page ("The Last Stage") is only on page 308 from 1966 onwards. It is on Page 301 in first editions, and 306 on second editions. The George Allen and Unwin on the Spine is written "George Allen & Unwin" on first editions.

If your book was in good condition with no missing pages and the dust-jacket, it would be worth £50 if it was a 1966, and less for a later copy. Without the copyright page and jacket, it isn't worth anything."

Edit: Based on the shade of green of the boards, it is one of the final two impressions of the third edition, 1974 or 1975.

Like Trotter says, no one could pass off the page block from a Facsimile first for the real thing. The paper looks nothing like that from an early Hobbit. Once you have collected a few older books (and by that I mean anything before HarperCollins), the modern low quality paper will be very obvious to you.

FWIW, I got no response from the seller. I have reported the listing, as I believe it contravenes eBay guidelines (claiming to be one thing, whilst putting the caveat that the seller is no expert, so it might be something else). I'd encourage anyone else to also report the listing. eBay doesn't usually pull these listings, but you never know.

I went through the three pull-downs & didn't really see a good fit for why I was reporting. What options did you choose?