By Urulókë
Thain (Admin)

Saul Zaentz Trademarks

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 3:39:21 AM UTC

A conversation on Twitter prompted me to do an idle check to see what US trademarks Saul Zaentz currently (as of July 2020) has active in regards to Tolkien properties - in case anyone finds this useful information. This can change over time as filings expire or are abandoned, and new ones are filed. Also it is good to note that the Saul Zaentz Company has the rights to many, many more names and terms that those covered in the list of active trademarks below. When and how they trademark certain things depends largely on what licenses they are issuing or considering, for example. Just because a character or place location is not on the list below does not mean that it is free to be used!

The home page for the US PTO search page is http://tmsearch.uspto.gov/

I poked around using various search terms, but had the best luck just searching for "Zaentz" in the Owner Name field.

Over seven hundred trademarks are currently active, when you include all the various permutations - depending on how the filing was done, contested, and modified, there could be, for example, half a dozen different trademarks issued for the same words but in different formats, like on T-shirts, boardgames, etc.

A quick and dirty, unsorted list of what I found. You will notice a few oddities - it appears that an occasional way that Zaentz resolves disputes is for Zaentz to trademark the disputed business name and then license it back to the other party (with unknown terms).

AN UNEXPECTED JOURNEY
ANDURIL
ARAGORN
ARKENSTONE
ARWEN
ARWEN EVENSTAR
BALROG
BARD THE BOWMAN
BATTLE OF FIVE ARMIES
BEORN
BILBO
BILBO BAGGINS
BOLG
CONQUER THE WORLD BENEATH
DAIN THE DWARF
DESOLATION OF SMAUG
ELROND
EOWYN
EREBOR
EVENSTAR
FARAMIR
FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING
FRODO
FRODO BAGGINS
FRODO'S PIZZA
GALADRIEL
GALADRIEL EVENDIM
GANDALF
GANDALF THE WHITE
GANDALF THE WIZARD-CLOWN
GIMLI
GLAMDRING
GOLLUM
GONDOR
GREEN DRAGON
GUARDIANS OF MIDDLE-EARTH
GWAIHIR
HOBBIT
HOBBITAT
HOBBITON
HOBBITS OF THE SHIRE
KHAZAD DUM
KILI THE DWARF
LA COMARCA
LE SEIGNEUR DES ANNEAUX
LEGEND OF FRODO
LEGOLAS
LEGOLAS GREENLEAF
LORD OF THE RINGS ONLINE
LOTHLORIEN
LOTR
M-E
M-E MIDDLE-EARTH
M-E MIDDLE-EARTH ENTERPRISES
MIDDLE EARTH
MIDDLE-EARTH QUEST
MIDDLE-EARTH: SHADOW OF MORDOR
MINAS TIRITH
MINES OF MORIA
MISTY MOUNTAINS
MITHRIL
MORDOR
MORIA
MOUNT DOOM
MY PRECIOUS
MY PRECIOUSSS
NARSIL
NENYA
ONE RING
ONE RING TO RULE THEM ALL
ORC
PALANTIR
PRANCING PONY
RADAGAST
RIDERS OF ROHAN
RINGWRAITH
RIVENDELL
RIVENDELL BICYCLE WORKS
ROHAN
ROHAN NUTRITION
RULE THEM ALL
SAMWISE GAMGEE
SARUMAN
SAURON
SAVE THE SHIRE
SHADOWS OF ANGMAR
SHELOB
SHIRE
SIEGE OF MIRKWOOD
SMAUG
SMAUG THE DRAGON
STING
STRIDER
TAURIEL
THE BATTLE FOR MIDDLE-EARTH
THE BATTLE OF THE FIVE ARMIES
THE FELLOWSHIP
THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING
THE HOBBIT
THE HOBBIT AN UNEXPECTED JOURNEY
THE HOBBIT THE BATTLE OF THE FIVE ARMIES
THE HOBBIT: AN UNEXPECTED JOURNEY
THE LORD OF THE RINGS
THE LORD OF THE RINGS THE FELLOWSHIP OF THE RING
THE LORD OF THE RINGS THE RETURN OF THE KING
THE LORD OF THE RINGS THE TWO TOWERS
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: ARAGORN'S QUEST
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: CONQUEST
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: MIDDLE-EARTH DEFENSE
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: WAR IN THE NORTH
THE LOTRO BEACON
THE ONE RING
THE RETURN OF THE KING
THE RISE OF THE WITCH-KING
THE SCENT OF MITHRIL
THE SHIRE
THE SHIRE'S REST
THE TWO TOWERS
THE WHITE COUNCIL
THERE AND BACK AGAIN
THORIN OAKENSHIELD
TREEBEARD
URUK-HAI
WAR OF THE RING
WAR OF THE RINGS
WITCH KING
YAZNEG

An interesting article about a Poultry company named ROHAN that was contested

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onthetrail
Home away from home

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 1:06:24 PM UTC

Wow that really is a 'dirty' list. I mean that in the sense of how SZ applies trademarks. Thanks for putting it together. It must be minefield when figuring if SZ really do own a certain trademark or have just registered it to deter others or stifle use by third parties.

I don't understand how SZ can claim trademarks on most of this stuff unless I am being entirely ignorant

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Trotter

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 1:29:54 PM UTC

Have asked the lawyer for the Tolkien Estate about these trademarks, i.e. does SZ have the rights to all of these Trademarks?

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Urulókë

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 1:55:12 PM UTC

@Trotter wrote:
Have asked the lawyer for the Tolkien Estate about these trademarks, i.e. does SZ have the rights to all of these Trademarks?

Remember that these are very specific “marks” used in trade. Each of them is very tightly defined, if you read the actual filings. SZ is not claiming they own all possible uses of “The Two Towers”. They have trademark filings for using those three words, in the “New Line Cinema” font, on T-shirts and mugs and calendars and... you get the idea.

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Trotter

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 2:01:29 PM UTC

@Urulókë wrote:
@Trotter wrote:
Have asked the lawyer for the Tolkien Estate about these trademarks, i.e. does SZ have the rights to all of these Trademarks?

Remember that these are very specific “marks” used in trade. Each of them is very tightly defined, if you read the actual filings. SZ is not claiming they own all possible uses of “The Two Towers”. They have trademark filings for using those three words, in the “New Line Cinema” font, on T-shirts and mugs and calendars and... you get the idea.

OK, so if I set up a UK Pub and called it "The Two Towers", do they own the trademark and could they sue me for trademark infringement?

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Urulókë

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 2:17:12 PM UTC

That’s a loaded question!

Everything above is in the US, not the UK. Probably very similar over there but keep that in mind.
The rights that Tolkien sold appear (to my non-legal eye) to allow the holder (at this time, SZ) the exclusive right to use them in almost all commercial “non-book” cases, as it relates to Tolkien’s creations specifically in The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings.

So if your Pub was branded with silhouettes of Birmingham landmarks and various local breweries, or anything non-Middle-earth, you’d probably be left alone.

If your pub had a glowing red eye pictures on top of one of the towers and lots of horse/sword/staff/orc images, you’d promptly receive a Cease & Desist order.

Everything in-between is quite murky and usually ends up in the courts or settled between lawyers.

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Trotter

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 2:39:28 PM UTC

Which is why I have asked the lawyer for the Tolkien Estate about these trademarks, i.e. does SZ have the rights to all of these Trademarks?

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Urulókë

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 3:05:01 PM UTC

@Trotter wrote:
Which is why I have asked the lawyer for the Tolkien Estate about these trademarks, i.e. does SZ have the rights to all of these Trademarks?

I will be interested to hear what they respond.

I fully expect, given the interactions between SZ (Middle-earth Enterprises) and the Estate for the movie lawsuit(s), the slot machine lawsuit(s) and the "amicable" relationship they have forged for the Amazon Prime series, that the Estate is fully aware of the trademarks that SZ has and uses, and carefully reviews them as they are filed (the filing process takes multiple years, and is public and open for review/response).

There are as many "dead" applications that have been abandoned or refused as there are currently active ones... so SZ by no means gets everything they ask for.

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onthetrail
Home away from home

12 Jul, 2020
2020-7-12 3:05:31 PM UTC

The only instances where I see SZ having any claim to these trademarks is if another entity uses specific imagery from one of the movies/games/merchandise that are covered in the original agreement. They cannot retrospectively trademark a name, for instance if I start a dog rescue centre and call it Bilbo's Walks and it has no relation to any of the property they own, they can't suddenly trademark that name and then come after me. If they are applying such broad strokes then they are doing so purely to be bully's against small enterprise who cannot fight them.

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Urulókë

12 Jul, 2020 (edited)
2020-7-12 3:12:22 PM UTC

@onthetrail wrote:
The only instances where I see SZ having any claim to these trademarks is if another entity uses specific imagery from one of the movies/games/merchandise that are covered in the original agreement. They cannot retrospectively trademark a name, for instance if I start a dog rescue centre and call it Bilbo's Walks and it has no relation to any of the property they own, they can't suddenly trademark that name and then come after me. If they are applying such broad strokes then they are doing so purely to be bully's against small enterprise who cannot fight them.

Again, not a lawyer, but... I think they most certainly can, and do. They own the rights to use all of the characters/places/etc. from LOTR and Hobbit in a wide variety of ways. They by no means have to have an active trademark to protect those rights.

If some entity was to start a dog walking business called Bilbo's Walks and the imagery/text had even the faintest whiff of Tolkien to it, SZ would have every right to challenge it. They don't always win (see the case link I posted about "Rohan" poultry as an example).

If some entity were to start a business called Celebrimbor's Jewelry they would (in my opinion) lose a court battle quickly, and either be shut down, or SZ would file a trademark and allow them to continue doing business but paying a licensing fee for the rights to that name. See the Gandalf the Wizard-Clown case link in the original article for something quite similar, or search out Rivendell Bicycle Works or some of the others also mentioned in my original article. There is no current business using this hypothetical Celebrimbor's Jewelry name, so there is no "trade" to have a "mark" for. Once there is a business, then there is "trade" and SZ would defend the right to use that name.

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