onthetrail wrote:

Trotter wrote:

The definition of the adverb for free is without cost or payment.

The book is a fixed price and would be the same price with or without the CD as I am paying for the book.

It fits the definition as far as I am concerned.

But you are paying for it.

I'm paying for the book which is a certain fixed price, with or without the CD.

I am therefore getting the CD for free.

I'm struggling with why you do not think it is a free item, as if they did not include it then I would have to spend £10 to buy the same CD.

Trotter wrote:

I'm paying for the book which is a certain fixed price, with or without the CD.

I am therefore getting the CD for free.

I'm struggling with why you do not think it is a free item, as if they did not include it then I would have to spend £10 to buy the same CD.

You are paying for a book with a CD included which has not been described as a free item. How you frame it is irrelevant to that constant. The cost has increased but the RRP has not. That is also another constant, when the costs rise but the consumer end price does not, the consumer pays with a poorer overall product. We see it all the time with products, and especially books.

Ultimately I don't want the CD included in the deluxe because I believe that it will hurt the quality of the overall product. You want it included because you consider it a freeby thrown in by HarperCollins above and beyond the book itself. Given what we know of HarperCollins treatment of books, I can't see how you or anybody else could possibly arrive at the conclusion that they are including the CD out of the kindness of their hearts.

My final comments on this.

I am very pleased that HarperCollins are including a free (no additional cost) CD with the Deluxe edition. I can not understand why you don't want this, but I am glad that they are doing this.

I've made it very clear why I don't want this and come delivery day I suspect you'll all find out why, although I will be very happy to be wrong about that.

I would rather they put the cost of the CD into the books production and have a separate CD release, which they have now announced of course.

onthetrail wrote:

although I will be very happy to be wrong about that.

I'll be very happy for you to be wrong about that too

Mr. Underhill wrote:

onthetrail wrote:

although I will be very happy to be wrong about that.

I'll be very happy for you to be wrong about that too

at last, we all agree on one element of this back and forth

So now we're prejudging the quality of a book no one has seen yet?

Huh.

Aelfwine wrote:

So now we're prejudging the quality of a book no one has seen yet?

Huh.

Given that HarperCollins quality issues have become a regular part of Tolkien publications, and this book having an added cost not previously associated with a release in this style, I feel it is reasonable to expect this new release to follow on with poor quality paper, bad printing, and poor quality control. That old saying, "insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" applies here. HarperCollins now have a track-record of publishing poor books and a collectors site should be able to discuss quality and the concerns surrounding future publications based on experience of previous failures by the publisher or else what is a collectors site for?

And I have not said it will be poor quality, only that I expect it to be given they have added another cost to the product.

This is a collector's website and this is a place to express frustration with printing issues regarding new releases from HC. We have and have had no issue with that. We feel it is important to have an accurate record of the QC issues that have been plaguing HarperCollins as of late and IF the new product has issues we can discuss them when those issues are actually in front of us.

I would also like to remind all members that we have a pretty firm policy against speculation without concrete evidence, as it is not helpful to collecting Tolkien books or other items in anyway. I would encourage everyone to hold off on speculating about future releases until there is something to go on.

Aelfwine wrote:

So now we're prejudging the quality of a book no one has seen yet?

Huh.

I suggest you re-read what has been written by onthetrail, as there was no such judgement, simply an expression that HC would be better spending the money on a decent book (something they seem increasingly reluctant to do, it seems) . All I read was the simple - and obvious - statement that if the book costs the same as prior releases, but it also includes an additional CD, then the cost of that CD will need to come from elsewhere in the overall production. I mean, that's pretty obvious. And the quality of FoN wasn't very good at that price point.

(And I agree with onthetrail - of course it isn't a "free CD". It is just a part of the overall package they specified at that price point. Calling it free is marketing fluff)

Personally I think a CD is a ridiculous anachronism.