Tapuvae (Chris) wrote:

Speaking of early editions, anyone following the sets offered on Heritage this month? I'd love to hear opinions on the first, first Hobbit, especially the restored jacket.

Don't know about this, can you provide a link?

Tapuvae (Chris) wrote:
The Antiquarian, I wonder if we know each other. I also collected vintage Star Wars toys and various other things. And now you know why third party grading is so popular in vintage toys, comics, coins, etc. I am about 2-3 years into the book hobby and find myself continuously disappointed as well. New books don't even come in mint condition because sellers pack them so poorly.

I have been looking for one of these for some time now.

http://tolkienbooks.net/php/details.php?reference=62330

I bought one and the slipcase was damaged structurally. Returned. I am trying to finish this set because one of my first major purchases was this set

http://tolkienbooks.net/php/details.php?reference=43400

Despite asking repeatedly about spine rubbing (which is so common you can even see it here) and being told repeatedly it was perfect, well, it was not. Better than most I had seen offered but still some slight rubbing.

Greetings Tapuvae! I am overjoyed to meet someone who also enjoys the beauty offered by Star Wars action figures! You are absolutely right about the existence of third party grading services making collectors' lives much easier. I never truly appreciated their service until I started book collecting.

I see that you are seeking the Hobbits Deluxe Illustrated Edition. This is purely a coincidence, but the stated edition is the very first book that I purchased as part of my Tolkien book collecting, directly from Mr. Pieter who runs Tolkien Library website. It is not in "fine" condition per say, but as this is the book that started it all on my Tolkien collecting binge, it holds sentimental value for me. I also purchased the Silmarillion Deluxe Illustrated Edition and that is when I decided to collect all things Silmarillion!

It has been several days since I posted my original thread and I have received two more First Edition Domestic and Export Edition Silmarillion. Upon receiving those copies, I once again wanted to rip all the pages off the book. I asked numerous times to both sellers and they adamantly stated that there are no flaws. Well, the domestic copy has several pages slightly torn and the export copy's map attached to the back of the book, is torn. Both from Abebook.com!

After receiving four copies of First Edition Silmarilions in shitty condition although I was promised by the sellers that hey are pristine and flawless, I am thinking of changing my collecting direction.

Instead of playing this lottery with unscrupulous sellers, I am thinking about attuning my collection to rare edition copies including the previously specified Deluxe Illustrated Edition and other Limited Deluxe Signed Copies of the Silmarillion.

Stu wrote:

They do exist, though (I have one, which was boxed with other GA&U books until I purchased it a decade ago, and which I keep in a dark drawer, rather than on the shelf), but we are now talking about a 40 year old book, and there can't be THAT many copies kept essentially in a box / out of light for their entire life.

Mr. Stu, I am very much intrigued. By any chance, have you taken pictures of this beautiful copy of Silmarillion in pristine condition? I would very much like to see it and use it as a reference when I purchase other Silmarillion!

I have been continuously receiving crappy copies of the so called "Fine" condition Silmarillion by unscrupulous sellers that now I am at the point of hallucinating that these damaged books are actually in "fine" conditions.

Tapuvae (Chris) wrote:
Surely there are exceptions and for these early editions it isn't an either or thing. You buy the copy you can afford basically. But for books that aren't particularly rare that were largely made to be collected (like the editions I linked to above) the expectation is that they weren't read, maybe thumbed through, but that's it. How many people use the COH SD for their reading copy?

Speaking of early editions, anyone following the sets offered on Heritage this month? I'd love to hear opinions on the first, first Hobbit, especially the restored jacket.

This is definitely the case. Early Hobbits (the first 4) would be an example of titles that are just too expensive (for me) to purchase in anything other than poor condition. Realistically, I'll likely never collect the first 3 impressions, as I'm happy enough with my tatty 4th (which was very cheap!).

I think my condition expectation with Hobbits slowly increases throughout the second edition, and from the late 1950s onward, I don't see much point in buying anything other than near fine (or close to). I genuinely don't care whether I buy the book now or in a decade, which gives a lot more likelihood of buying a nice book at a sensible price.

For the modern collector editions, I figure you might as well get fine copies, as very few of them will have been read anyway. That said, I largely lost interest in books that were created specifically to be collectables. I don't have them all, and have no interest in collecting the ones I haven't got. I find standard editions of (older) books to be a lot more "honest". The pleasure I get from finding (for example) a really nice Longman's Hobbit far exceeds that which I get from acquiring a deluxe edition.

The_Antiquarian wrote:

Mr. Stu, I am very much intrigued. By any chance, have you taken pictures of this beautiful copy of Silmarillion in pristine condition? I would very much like to see it and use it as a reference when I purchase other Silmarillion!

I'm sure I posted some pictures up here at one point when previously discussing Sils, but finding the thread is probably impossible. I'll either dig out some existing photos or take some for you.

As requested, pictures of my copy (without the mylar protector). Even with this copy, one can find slight imperfections, but one has to be realistic -- these are things made out of paper and cloth that had to be bound, packaged, shipped, stored, etc. BUT, there were 250,000 copies printed -- that is a lot to choose from.

https://historical.ha.com/itm/books/sc ... &tab=MyTrackedLots-101116

Heritage uses beautiful large format images as well. There was a second Hobbit and two lots for LOTR in this auction as well, it slipped my mind that it closed today.

I haven't done my homework on these early editions to know what flaws to look for or if this jacket is respectable or acceptable to the book world (28k dollars suggests so). Also, I may be spending too much time in the comic art and vintage toy world, because if this is really the cream of the crop then 28k is really quite a low value. This doesn't come near top end pieces in any of the other things I collect.

Tapuvae (Chris) wrote:
https://historical.ha.com/itm/books/sc ... &tab=MyTrackedLots-101116

Heritage uses beautiful large format images as well. There was a second Hobbit and two lots for LOTR in this auction as well, it slipped my mind that it closed today.

I haven't done my homework on these early editions to know what flaws to look for or if this jacket is respectable or acceptable to the book world (28k dollars suggests so). Also, I may be spending too much time in the comic art and vintage toy world, because if this is really the cream of the crop then 28k is really quite a low value. This doesn't come near top end pieces in any of the other things I collect.

The jacket has had restoration. It would probably have been worth more if it was an unrestored jacket in the same condition. At the end of the day, these early jackets are very delicate, so that copy has a lovely jacket. If it was a 1971 copy, it would be considered a crap jacket (amazing what a difference 35 years and production volume makes). These kinds of books and prices are not even on my radar, though. I wouldn't want the burden of looking after (storing, insuring) that kind of value of book. I'd be getting an inexpensive (in relative terms) copy and using a facsimile jacket, keeping the rest of the money in the bank!

My main observation is that there are more 1937 1sts and 2nds coming to market at the moment, so it feels like that is not a situation where these would be a bankable investment. I could be entirely wrong.

Its pretty amazing how you (well I) cannot see the restoration except from the backside. It looks like they took an other jacket and welded the paper together. Is that generally how this would work? Or is the restoration a complete fabrication. They, conveniently, don't disclose this kind of information.

I am not really looking to spend 28k on a book either, but I was referencing the fact that 28k can buy you an ok piece of original comic art where the top top pieces are in the 500-700k range now. For vintage Star Wars toys, 28k can buy you a lot of common stuff but maybe 1-2 rare and high grade items. I sold my collection several years ago and that collection would now be worth upwards of 50-75k. But a 1st edition Hobbit - I just can't see the upward pricing pressure for an item like this. Still as a "1 and done" if that's your thing, I bet Harry Potter books sell in this range (or more) now.

Tapuvae (Chris) wrote:
Its pretty amazing how you (well I) cannot see the restoration except from the backside. It looks like they took an other jacket and welded the paper together. Is that generally how this would work? Or is the restoration a complete fabrication. They, conveniently, don't disclose this kind of information.

Suitable (usually old and salvaged) paper is normally added to replace the missing areas (and blended in by abrading the edges using very fine abrasive media) and bonded using a reversible adhesive (such as wheat paste). Tears are repaired using japanese paper and wheat paste. The missing material is then painted in using acrylic paints. The idea is that such restorations should be completely reversible (although proving that this is the case would be tricky). I've seen non-Tolkien jacket restorations that look incredible, even down to washing the jacket and drying it between two panes of glass. Not a cheap process, and probably not many people capable of doing it.